Well just got stopped from repairing the pads at acme. Security guard told me that I can't touch it unless I'm employed by Masterman. Tried to tell him I got permission to work on it but he obviously didn't listen. Because I didn't get to finish foam modding our already janky pads they are worse then ever. I did what I could before I had to stop...

I'm done doing repairs, this was the last straw for me, someone else can do it. I'm tired of working with dead/broken sensors and having to dump $20+ and 4-5+ hours every time I try to fix it because I can't access the sensor input.. I literally have failed 15-20 songs to get the right balance for the pads to function properly. It's hard to keep the pads maintained by myself, let alone with nearly zero material to work with.

Most likely if someone doesn't pick up the modding job at ACME, all the modding is probably going to be removed and we can go back to super recessed, janky, messed up pads. I did what I could, I'm sorry but I can't keep fixing the panels.

 

What the fuck man.

Hmm...now I know why I've been getting random Way Offs and such...

Hey Chris,

I have not talked to the people at Acme yet, but I have a pretty good guess.  It is likely they wanted you to stop working on it, as it was a weekend night wnen it's busy there.  the owners there have always asked that we just do bare minimum repairs during peak open hours, as it just looks more professional when everything is together and running.  They also like everything to be available and playable. 
In the afternoon, on a quiet day, is a great time, and security is not there, either.  They only have security during peak hours, so right there, that's a good guideline. 

Yeah I understand why they asked me to stop. I also understand that I only repair the panels if I absolutely have too and when it was appropriate. Last night, only people in the arcade was a family playing the big claw game and the occasionall person playing driving games. Nobody was waiting to play ITG and the repair wouldn't have taken more than 15 mins. The pads as they are, I'd say are unplayable. You can play on them but for serious players it is not worth the money. We haven't been able to score on the pads for over two weeks and I'm obviously frustrated with the issues the panels have been having. Hopefully someone with more time can handle them now.

I guess the biggest issue I had was with how I was treated by the security guard. I understand he was doing a job but I'm a grown man and should be treated as such. I have an issue being talked down to, as if I was a child. Something should be done about this security guard. I know that this particular guard has given other people some issues as well, perhaps it's something I should make known to the management at acme.

I think you need to take everything into perspective here. I don't think the Acme machine has ever been consider a crap for long. I mean, I told you maintaining foam modded pads in a public place wouldn't be easy.

I feel for you wasting your own money, though. I've done the same at many DDR places here on on the east side trying to keep them in a playable state.

Personally, I think you're trying to get the pads at a state that just isn't easily achieved or maintained in a public venue as popular and busy as Acme Bowl is.

I think you are absolutely right. I guess I cared a lot about ACME and the ITG 3 machine there. It is the best public access cabinet in our state and I wanted to maintain it as best as I could. I wanted to give people who play on it the best, but I guess it isn't possible here. If I had access to more parts, for instance, more sensors and access into the input testing I'd have an easier time maintaining it.

I tried... 

I'm going back tomorrow to finish what I started Friday night so it is playable for people. From that point on, I don't know if I can keep maintaining it. I did what I could... 

I'll see you there by noon.

ACME doesn't open until 3pm on Mondays.

Okay finished reworking the pads today and I think I found the perfect solution to making these panels work wonders.

As of right now every panel has tape and foam only on the inner sensors to help with false triggering and sticky panels.

Player 1 Side:
Every arrow panel has 1 layer of double sided foam tape, 2 strips of weather stripping, and 10 layers of tape layered on top of one another.

Player 2 Side:
Top Arrow has 1 layer of double sided foam tape, 2 strips of weather stripping, and 14 layers of tape.

Right Arrow has 1 layer of double sided foam tape, 2 strips of weather stripping, and 16 layers of tape.

Left Arrow has 1 layer of double sided foam tape, 2 strips of weather stripping, and 17 layers of tape.

Down Arrow has 1 layer of double sided foam tape, 2 strips of weather stripping, and 17 layers of tape.

I believe with the arrows modded this way, we are able to upkeep the panels with minimal effort because of the minimal amount of work. 

Visited Saturday night and the ITG Player2 Down arrow is requiring heavy pressure just to hold any freeze arrows successfully.

The pads were looking a little tacky currently, with half the corner metal securing covers missing : |
Seems to be causing the panels to protrude or lean diagonally instead of all being flat.

Finished doing more work on them yet again! 

I played today and I didn't find any issues regarding the excessive pressure needed to hold down freeze/hold notes on the player 2 side.

The down arrow on the Player 2 side seemed to be in working order. The left side down arrow on the Player 1 side on the other hand wasn't responding to well. What I noticed was that the sensor on the down arrow was a little touchy/sticky so I rotated it and it is now working.

As far as the triangle brackets go... 

I found that placing them corner to corner helps with false triggering and sticking. To help with the "leaning," I placed foam and tape underneath the triangle brackets to alleviate the rocking of the panels. Initially, I took the foam/tape off from underneath the triangle brackets to make maintenance as minimal as possible, but soon realized that the arrows rocked. Therefore, the foam/tape is now replaced beneath the triangle brackets. 

If the triangle brackets are placed on the inner brackets, they cause the arrows to freeze/stick making them unplayable. This is the reasoning behind placing the brackets corner to corner.

After foaming underneath the triangle brackets, the panels seemed flush with the center panel, just as they should be.

Modding/Maintaining these arrows is a lot harder than I'd expected especially because Abbye and I are the only people working on them. We are doing EVERYTHING we can to keep these pads in excellent working order.

Just wanted to mention that I've been having such a difficult time with the up arrow on both sides... They are triggering decently well, but when you stream at a higher bpm (180-2xx bpm), not all of your steps are registered. I don't know if I should be modding the up arrow any differently to help with this problem... Footswitching is near impossible unless you practically stomp on the up arrow.

Anyone have any suggestions to help fix this? 

Hey guys,

Played at ACME today and noticed that someone tampered with the Player 1 side. The right arrow isn't working at all. I called the Technician to come to take a look at the arrow. I am not sure what is wrong with the arrow so I couldn't fix it myself. The arrow isn't registering at all, it appeared to be stuck. I have a hunch that it has to do with the wiring but I'm not 100% sure. 

The right side was working perfectly before today. Please, I beg, if you don't know how to work with the arrows and the sensors, don't touch it. I've been working on them tirelessly to make these arrows be at 100% but with set backs like these, it makes working on them much, MUCH, harder. Once the Tech fixes the problem with the right arrow on the Player 1 side, I will revert the foam modding back to its original state. Hopefully, re-modding will lead to better pads.

On a lighter/brighter note! 

I reworked the Player 2 side and reverted back to the way I foam modded about 3 months ago. I've been testing different methods in hopes of getting the Player 2 side panels to be SUPER flush but I came to the conclusion that it isn't possible. Considering the sensors at ACME are beyond sensitive, having the panels SUPER flush caused a multitude of problems. Albeit, they felt amazing when they were SUPER flush, we couldn't score worth a damn. Therefore, I've reverted back to few layers of weather stripping and tape, instead of double sided foam, weather stripping, and 15-20 layers of tape. The pads aren't recessed but they aren't flush either. There are a few false triggers every once in awhile but only at 200+ bpm. At this point, this is the best method for the ACME pads and this is how they will stay.

FYI,

Yes, the player one side is down hard.  I see on our tech report from Saturday that the dead arrow is being caused by the an I/O board failure.  The tech noted that some sensors were not connected, and bare wiring could have been grounding itself out on the metal parts of the stage.  That is likely what blew the I/O board.

Please, when working with that, be sure no bare wires are available to touch anything.

The game is likely to be down awhile, have to find an I/O board, unless one of the weekday super techs can do a component replacement on the existing one.

The big thing, never let a bare wire touch the metal of the stage.  We will do our best to get that arrow back in service.

Hello old friends. With permission I'd like to have an old itg friend and much more experienced pad modifier take a look at the current situation and see if we can finally come up with a sustainable and reliable fix. This of course being after the electrical problems are fixed. Does this sound reasonable, and can we expect the electrical problems fixed maybe in the next week or so? Or maybe have an approximate time frame? I will do my best to ensure that these frustrating times cease, and we all may find ourselves once again in a blissful oasis of dance games. These times have been arduous, soldiers. But heroes are not born, they are BUILT. Built of ARROWS. And soon it will again be battle...

 

I wish I could say when that I/O board will be fixed.  we are bringing it to the shop Monday, our tech will take a look at doing a component level repair.  Looks like a chip got blown up do to an obvious short where wiring came in contact with the metal stage.
If no luck there, we will have to order a new I/O board from Andamiro, who built the cabinet.  If they have it in stock, a few more dyas downtime.  If not in stock, and it has to come from their parent company in korea, it could be weeks.  Hoping that not to be the case, only a worst case scenario.

Ok, thanks as always for all your guys' hard work. And we're very sorry for this unfortunate accident; proper cautions will be taken in the future.

It's unfortunate with what happened. It's beyond frustrating when people temper with the panels. I noticed some components of the stage were moved around and changed when I got back to ACME Saturday night, that's when I noticed the arrow wasn't functioning.

When I work on the panels I make sure that I take every precaution to make sure something like an I/O failure doesn't happen. I care about this machine, probably a little more than I should. I take the utmost care when I work with it.

I just don't understand when half the work I do on pads are ripped out or in this case an arrow is just rendered useless.

I also wanted to make note about the exposed wires... A lot of the wire caps are gone or have fallen off. I've used electrical tape to secure most of them!

As far as someone else working on the panels, sounds fine but I would like to note that I've reverted the panels back to how they were originally foam modded and scoring is 100% possible on the player 2 side. It's very, VERY rare for false triggers to occur on the player 2 side now with the old foaming method.

If someone else does do work on the panels I'd hope he/she could post on this thread all the changes he/she has made.

As always I am very appreciative of the Masterman Team working hard to keep us gamers happy! Thank you!

It's actually been like that the entire day. Don't know when but I was there that afternoon and it was already like that. Definitely wasn't Allan or me.

Oh, and about the pieces being moved, it was just a MasterMan checking on the pad, nothing much was done to it except for testing which wires were unplugged from the board - didn't seem to say much about the problem.

Hope this clarified some stuff.

Oh yeah I know I wasn't Allan or you, haha. Might have been Friday night, not sure when or what happened. Just sucks pretty bad. 

I almost went on that side.. because I usually prefer the left anyway.
So I'm guessing since it's not an issue of the inability to register the input, it must be that it's stuck or something..?

As Bill mentioned, the I/O fried due to exposed wires touching the metal stage. I'm not entirely sure how that even happened considering that most of the wires were covered and/or had electrical tape protecting them.

I actually thought that the wires touched the metal under the triangle brackets but as Abbye pointed out, that wouldn't be possible since the panels go underneath them.

So, I'm extremely confused as to how and why the I/O fried. 

These are troubling times INDEED...

Hey, so I thought I'd mention that I played on Sunday and the right side was quite good, so rather than leaving the machine removed altogether while we wait for a fix, might it be reasonable to just disconnect the left side and put up a sign? That way we could still play in the interim. Obviously we have Christmas in the next couple days, but maybe after? Whatever can be done of course is appreciated! Thanks!

 



                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                

Good news,
Yes, something had grounded out and blew up some I.C chips on the I/O board. 
Our best component level repair technician was Acme a good share of the day today.  He was able to source the I.C. chips nearby, and did a component level repair replacing all the I.C. chips on the I/O board.  And no, these damn chips are not socketed, that would just have made it to damn easy, LOL's.

Game up and fully playing.   Told the guys to just leave whatever they thought was janky the same as far as foam mods.  So back to your tweaking.  Just be sure to have some electrical tape.  :-)

That's awesome. Time to bust some moves.